apartment therapy changing the world, one room at a time

Please, please, please. Compare prices for Apple laptops to identically equipped peecee's and you'll find very, very little price gap. It's only when you compare unlike that the price gap seems huge. This is an old myth, disproved many times.

I would disagree, nothingfuture. There's a substantial price gap between Macs and PCs. Many Mac owner tout their computer's 'reliability' but I've yet to see it. Every Mac I've owned or used have been just as 'quirky'/buggy as a PC. Some people pay for style and brand recognition over value (i.e. BMW, Mercedes Benz), which I suppose goes a long way.

@nothingfuture: Gladly ;) Lets look at the higher end models of Apple, Dell, and Lenovo
Macbook Pro 15", Core 2 Duo 2.4GHz, 2GB ram, 250GB drive at 5400 rpm, etc.--------$1,999
Dell Precision 4400 15", same processor, same ram, 250GB drive at 7200 rpm, etc.--------$1,377
Lenovo Thinkpad T500 15", same processor, same ram, same drive, etc. ---------$1,254

Also, keep in mind, that dell and lenovo offer many times the options and upgrade that apple offers and dell comes with a 3 year warranty at no extra cost.

Also, macs have been fraught with major problems over the last few years, most recently the vertical lines in the 17" unibody macbook pro.

Although a loaded PC is much cheaper right now than a comparable MAC, running windows for me has always presented far more problems than any Apple I have ever had. There is crashing, viruses etc that in a mac either don't exist or you just restart (in less than half the time) and problem solved. Yeah, yeah I drank the cool aid...but in my cult there is no control alt delete, and I get to print to pdf! AMAZING.

@charmac

I did my own price check with that same Precision 4400 but made sure it was a lot more fair. Now, even I will admit that there is a premium to the Apple side of life but it isn't as big a void as some think (or would like to).

I added a lot to that Dell. Made sure it had bluetooth, n wireless, a backlit keyboard, higher capacity battery to fit that of the MBP, a superdrive (DVD-R), a higher resolution display (came stock with one that would normally be in a MacBook), etc. The advantage the Dell had over the MBP was higher video card memory and a faster HD.

So what was the outcome?

Stock MacBook Pro 15" = $1999

Highly upgraded Dell 15" = $1686 ($2,056 without the special "instant savings" Dell was offering).

Even with the savings, the gap was narrowed by a huge margin. It then comes down to the operating system, built-in software, etc. Both can run Windows natively and if you like hacking your computer you can manage OS X on the Dell (not something for your average consumer).

Nouniard

Apology for the double post...

Went back and did the same for the Lenovo T500. With all the upgraded wifi, bluetooth, battery, webcam, display (Yup...it too had a 15" display with the same resolution as the consumer MacBook), HD, etc. the outcome was....

Stock MacBook Pro = $1999
Upgraded Lenovo = $1,518 sale price ($1,958 standard)

Nouniard

@Nouniard, for the Dell, I'm getting $1543 with your upgrades.

It's also worth noting that with most PCs you have many more options, so if I don't want an illuminated keyboard (and why would I?) I don't have to pay an extra 40 bucks for one. If I don't have wireless N, why pay for a card with it? But, If I want a WUXGA display, I can add it.

Also, Dell and Lenovo are ALWAYS on sale. It's just the way they work to make it look like you are getting substantial savings.

I'm by no means a MS fanboy. I think MS royally screwed up Vista so I switched back to XP. There's something to be said for an OS that still works well after 8 years. But, I'm hopeful that Windows 7 will be a major improvement. My experience with the beta has been promising.

As for Mac OS, I've never been convinced by the included software. I can do everything that comes with a mac, using freeware with more functionality (including printing to PDF!) on the PC.

I'm not sure where you got off on your calculation and I see what you mean about the 'permanent' savings

Sure you can get a computer that doesn't have a backlit keyboard (though it helps in low light situations), sure you don't have to have wireless N, sure you don't have to have this or that but why wag your finger at Apple for not catering to the bottom end. They have their standards and their limits as to how low their willing to go. They're not going to go to dollar store prices to compete with that market. Someone else can do that and enjoy the customers (e.g. Dell).

This isn't directed at you but I do find it funny how many PC users like to fling the feature list book into Apple's face but then retract it all when it comes to getting really cheap. It's sort of like MS's new ad with the 'hip' girl in the VW who wants to buy a 17" notebook for under $1000. She walks into the Apple store, walks right back out complaining about the prices and how she's not "cool enough" to be a Mac user. She then proceeds to a Best Buy and searches out a $699 HP 17" notebook with absolutely abysmal specs. It's retarded.

Of course as I've said before, even when the specs are aline you pay a premium for a Mac and I have no problem admitting that. Sort of like Sony for the PC world I suppose.

Eh, back to good design on Apartment Therapy. :)

Nouniard

I've spent all morning patching servers and workstations for tomorrow's April fools Conficker fun. Go ahead and ask me what OS I've got running at home.

Properly configured and updated any OS runs great and secure, but if you're flying MS, you're starting out with a great big bullseye target.

My take is that when Jobs and company get it right, they produce hardware and software that are intuitive to use and exemplify good design principles well worth the premium.

Oh how I wish they make macbook minis, i find my macbook just too heavy and annoying to carry around but I could never switch to a pc.

once mac, always mac

With effort and skill, you can get a PC to perform at the level of a mac for less money. But most PC users don't. Sure, you can get software to print to pdf on the PC, but most people don't have it. Yeah, you can do all the functionality in the world with freeware, but most people don't. PC users are less likely to experiment with software options because it is just too much trouble to do anything beyond the mission critical basics. And if you do mange to get something new working, then it will probably break in the next round of security updates sending you back to step 1. The PC model makes sense for people who don't mind fiddling with their machine or people who don't need much functionality. But your average user will get more performance out of a mac.

to the point of this post....

It's a fake.

To the point of the thread...Apple charges a premium for their product. That won't go away. Ever.

Nor apparently, will the debate over whether or not that premium is worth it. Ever.

I'm looking forward to the next round in the battle with 7 and Snow Leapord. In both cases the consumer wins.

@Gherm- me too. It's been a VERY busy couple of weeks at work. The rest of your post is spot-on as well.

@RJHD3- And no one will EVER change their computing preferences based on these religious wars. This crap gets old, and lately I've been seeing a LOT of this on forums; some of it is "grass-roots" paid shilling (I'm two degrees away from the ad agency MS hired and have some inside info about this. Believe me, there are 500 paid shillers). Not that I'm against a little subterfuge, but to see this garbage on ASTRONOMY sites, when there is a very miniscule mention of a Mac, makes me want to rip my hair out.

Sorry... that should read "500 paid shillers"...

This comments board hates the plus sign, I guess... "500 PLUS paid shillers"...

@CygnusX1:

By the ad agency I assume you mean the 'award winning' Crispin Porter & Bogusky?

That doesn't quite work out. They have roughly 900 employees. So I doubt that's the case.

Microsoft has roughly 3500 MVP's (technically proficient people who support Microsoft communities but are not representatives of the company nor paid by Microsoft). Far more likely that an active community network is engaged in spreading their opinion.

Microsoft has earned its fans as well as its haters.